Mathematica 9 is now available
Services & Resources / Wolfram Forums
-----
 /
MathGroup Archive
2002
*January
*February
*March
*April
*May
*June
*July
*August
*September
*October
*November
*December
*Archive Index
*Ask about this page
*Print this page
*Give us feedback
*Sign up for the Wolfram Insider

MathGroup Archive 2002

[Date Index] [Thread Index] [Author Index]

Search the Archive

Re: Re: Off by 0.00000001, Why?

  • To: mathgroup at smc.vnet.net
  • Subject: [mg37411] Re: [mg37390] Re: [mg37378] Off by 0.00000001, Why?
  • From: jmt <jmt at dxdydz.net>
  • Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 06:33:04 -0500 (EST)
  • References: <768AB868-E81E-11D6-86DE-0003938BF55C@jeol.com> <200210260603.CAA29496@smc.vnet.net>
  • Reply-to: jmt at dxdydz.net
  • Sender: owner-wri-mathgroup at wolfram.com

That's why you can use Mathematica arbitrary precision function to control 
your results.
But you must know first what to control.

On Saturday 26 October 2002 08:03, Steven T. Hatton wrote:
> On Friday 25 October 2002 09:34 am, you wrote:
> > This is not surprising.  First of all as you correctly pointed out the
> > Mathematica routines you are calling may have changed and therefore
> > produce different results.
>
> This is not a high priority for me, but it would be nice to know how to
> identify the source of such discrepancies.
>
> > Secondly your OS and hardware platform may
> > not be identical and in my experience the same compiler may produce
> > different results on different hardware and OS combinations due to
> > different optimizations applied to floating point expressions.
> > Finally, Intel chips have floating point registers that are actually 80
> > bits wide.  Thus they perform some floating point operations
> > differently than a pure 64 bit machine because they may use 80 bits for
> > intermediate results.  See
> > http://www.validlab.com/goldberg/addendum.html for a reasonable summary
> > of the issues with floating point computations on different
> > architectures.
>
> I *believe* Java trys to create a platform neutral computing environment
> which insures results will be uniform across platforms.  IIRC, I read
> something about this kind of thing in the Mathematica documentation.  There
> are ways of manipulating the content of atoms which can be used to optimize
> performance, but they are discouraged because they can lead to the kinds of
> discrepancies were are discussing.... Indeed, see A.1.4 of the Mathematica
> Book: (4.2, Help Browser)
>
> "As an optimization for some special kinds of computations, the raw data in
> Mathematica atomic objects can be given explicitly using Raw[head,
> "hexstring"]. The data is specified as a string of hexadecimal digits,
> corresponding to an array of bytes. When no special output form exists,
> InputForm prints special objects using Raw. The behavior of Raw differs
> from one implementation of Mathematica to another; its general use is
> strongly discouraged. "
>
> > > Any thoughts on this?
> >
> > If your floating point calculations are mission critical you have to
> > use a compiler which allows you to control whether floating point
> > expressions are optimized.  Also you have to use a CPU architecture
> > whose behavior you understand.  Finally all of your algorithms must be
> > analyzed to guarantee you understand and have compensated for the
> > floating point model of your compiler and CPU.  This is why mission
> > critical code such as for NASA is typically audited by a team before
> > being committed to production code.
>
> I do seem to recall a lost probe not too long ago.  Seems someone forgot to
> convert from miles to kilometers, or something like that. To my mind that
> was just plain stupidity.  They should never have been using imperial units
> in the first place.
>
> Nonetheless, this demonstrates the kinds of things which can creep into
> your calculations.  Suppose the Auditors come in and bless everything off,
> and the next week you get a brand new computer. Not realizing that the
> hardware will influence the outcome of your calculation, you copy
> everything over to the new system, give the nice lady at WRI a call to get
> your new password, and run the calculations 10 times faster, but based on
> assumptions which are inconsistent with your current environment.  Ooops, 
> "Houston, we've got a problem."
>
> > Regards,
> >
> > Ssezi


  • Prev by Date: FW: Re: To plot solutions, FindRoot as a function
  • Next by Date: RE: Re: help on bootstrap sample
  • Previous by thread: Re: Off by 0.00000001, Why?
  • Next by thread: Re: Off by 0.00000001, Why?