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MathGroup Archive 2007

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Re: Re: Re: Re: v6: still no multiple undo?

  • To: mathgroup at smc.vnet.net
  • Subject: [mg77492] Re: [mg77476] Re: [mg77433] Re: [mg77407] Re: v6: still no multiple undo?
  • From: Andrzej Kozlowski <akoz at mimuw.edu.pl>
  • Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2007 07:22:44 -0400 (EDT)
  • References: <200706080938.FAA03696@smc.vnet.net> <200706090943.FAA17991@smc.vnet.net> <acbec1a40706090337i64852d8cja3b1b942c7b29fec@mail.gmail.com>

The idea that people always run the best software they could seems  
rather doubtful to me, but is completely  irrelevant. I think you  
completely missed the point of the article, which does not claim the  
older software was better, but only that a lot of new software  
(certainly not all) is "bloated" - a completely different thing. Did  
you really think that the reason I posted this link was because I  
would rather use Mathematica 1 than Mathematica 6?

Andrzej Kozlowski

On 9 Jun 2007, at 19:37, Chris Chiasson wrote:

> I disagree with the article. If the older software were really better,
> then everyone would still be using it.
>
> On 6/9/07, Andrzej Kozlowski <akoz at mimuw.edu.pl> wrote:
>> I understand that thera are many people would like have WRI implement
>> in Mathematica  one or more of their favourite features of other
>> programs.  After all, we all now have multi-gigaherz processors,
>> gigabytes of RAM etc, and wouldn't it be great if Mathematica could
>> do all the things that all these other programs do? You might even
>> not need them any more.
>> However,  this kind of approach has its price and to see this clearly
>> I suggest that, before submitting another request for another "great
>> feature you can't live without", everyone reads this:
>>
>> http://hubpages.com/hub/
>> _86_Mac_Plus_Vs_07_AMD_DualCore_You_Wont_Believe_Who_Wins
>>
>> and thinks again if this price is really worth paying.
>>
>>
>> Andrzej Kozlowski
>>
>>
>> On 8 Jun 2007, at 18:38, Barthelet, Luc wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > While I strongly support that multiple undo is a feature we need to
>> > see
>> > soon, it will take some real work to get there.
>> >
>> > The editor, and the kernels are linked in an efficient exchange of
>> > messages
>> > and information about what needs to be displayed where and when.
>> >
>> > While implementing multiple undo-redo in a stand alone editor  
>> usually
>> > requires only to implement a tokenized undo-redo, in the v6 font
>> > end, it
>> > will require a more complex model. It is a bit like if you were
>> > trying to
>> > implement multiple undo on a wiki site like wikipedia where they  
>> are
>> > multiple contributors.
>> >
>> > We probably do not want the kernel to "undo", just the front end.
>> > So one
>> > solution would be to make the kernel and the user to appear as a
>> > single
>> > contributor, and to undo both effects on the front end. So one undo
>> > might
>> > remove an output created by the kernel.
>> >
>> > Even that is challenging, because Dynamics now create a lot of
>> > updates and
>> > you will not want to roll those back.
>> >
>> > Anyway, the front end team is obviously smart enough to find a
>> > solution for
>> > all those things, but it is not going to be easy.
>> >
>> > A cheap thing that I would like to see, is a text buffer of all my
>> > input and
>> > all the code I deleted saved as a log on disk. It might be ugly,
>> > but it
>> > would be VERY USEFUL.
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> >
>> > Luc
>> >
>> >
>> > On 6/7/07 3:34 AM, "David Bailey" <dave at Remove_Thisdbailey.co.uk>
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >> David wrote:
>> >>> Will Robertson wrote:
>> >>>> Hello,
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I am baffled that technical software is released in 2007 with
>> >>>> only a
>> >>>> single undo level. Am I missing something here? Is it because  
>> I'm
>> >>>> using a student license? How hard can an undo stack really be in
>> >>>> the
>> >>>> notebook interface?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I've been irritated a few times in v5.2 from clumsy keypresses
>> >>>> losing
>> >>>> me work that I would expect to be two "undo"s away. Alas not.
>> >>>> Still.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Will Robertson
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Good point! I've wondered the same thing for a long time. This is
>> >>> the
>> >>> only app I run that doesn't happen multiple levels of undo. I
>> >>> think it's
>> >>> time WRI spent some time on this issue.
>> >>>
>> >> How much time could it possibly take! Once you have a 1-level undo
>> >> working, all you need to do is spill the relevant data into a
>> >> structure
>> >> - possibly on disk - and retrieve it as needed!
>> >>
>> >> David Bailey
>> >> http://www.dbaileyconsultancy.co.uk
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> -- 
> http://chris.chiasson.name/



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