Re: Re: TransformationFunctions
- To: mathgroup at smc.vnet.net
- Subject: [mg102175] Re: [mg102115] Re: TransformationFunctions
- From: Andrzej Kozlowski <akoz at mimuw.edu.pl>
- Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 05:57:23 -0400 (EDT)
- References: <h46p31$e4g$1@smc.vnet.net> <200907230754.DAA26659@smc.vnet.net> <200907300929.FAA21410@smc.vnet.net>
On 30 Jul 2009, at 18:29, O wrote:
> On Jul 24, 3:14 am, Andrzej Kozlowski <a... at mimuw.edu.pl> wrote:
>> On 24 Jul 2009, at 15:46, Oles Zaburannyi wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> 2009/7/23 Andrzej Kozlowski <a... at mimuw.edu.pl>
>>
>>> On 23 Jul 2009, at 16:54, Peter Breitfeld wrote:
>>
>>> ".... at ntaxa.com" wrote:
>>
>>> Can anyone advice why following code does not work:
>>
>>> In[538]:=tf[z_NonCommutativeMultiply] := -z[[2]]**z[[1]]
>>> In[539]:=Simplify[x ** y + y ** x,TransformationFunctions -> {tf,
>>> Automatic}]
>>> Out[539]:=x ** y + y ** x
>>
>>> I expect rather 0
>>
>>> By the way:
>>> In[540]:=x ** y + tf[y ** x]
>>> Out[540]:=0
>>
>>> I think, the problem here is, that Simplify will apply tf to both
>>> products. So I would suggest you do something like this:
>>
>>> tfrule = (x_ ** y_ + y_ ** x_) :> 0;
>>> tf[expr_] := expr /. tfrule;
>>> Simplify[x ** y + y ** x, TransformationFunctions -> {tf}]
>>
>>> Out=0
>>
>>> -- _________________________________________________________________
>>> Peter Breitfeld, Bad Saulgau, Germany --http://www.pBreitfeld.de
>>
>>> There are problems with this approach.
>>> Consider:
>>
>>> tfrule = (x_ ** y_ + y_ ** x_) :> 0;
>>> tf[expr_] := expr /. tfrule;
>>
>>> Simplify[x ** y + y ** x, TransformationFunctions -> {tf}]
>>> 0
>>
>>> but
>>
>>> Simplify[2 x ** y + y ** x, TransformationFunctions -> {tf}]
>>> 2 x ** y + y ** x
>>
>>> by contrast:
>>
>>> tf1[expr_] :=
>>> expr /. z_NonCommutativeMultiply :> If[Not[OrderedQ[z]], -Sort[z],
>>> z]
>>
>>> In[42]:= Simplify[x ** y + y ** x, TransformationFunctions ->
>>> {Automatic, tf1}]
>>> Out[42]= 0
>>
>>> but also
>>
>>> Simplify[2 x ** y + y ** x, TransformationFunctions -> {Automatic,
>>> tf1}]
>>> x ** y
>>
>>> Andrzej Kozlowski
>>
>>> thanks, but your solution give incorrect result for
>>
>>> In[3]:=Simplify[(z ** x ** y + z ** y ** x),
>>> TransformationFunctions -> {Automatic, tf1}]
>>> Out[3]:=-2 x ** y ** z
>>> (should be 0)
>>
>>> As i understand my main problem is that Simplify apply
>>> transformation function and select simplest form AT EACH STEP.
>>> So, if globally simplest form is achieved only by MORE COMPLEX
>>> intermediate forms that simplification will be omited.
>>
>>> Am i right?
>>
>>> in another words simplification like
>>
>>> initial form -> a bit complex form -> maybe even more complex form -
>>>> simplest form
>>
>>> is omited by Simplify?
>>
>>> --
>>> No Signature
>>
>> You are right. I did not give this enough thought and did not
>> consider =
>
>> the possibility of multiplying more than two
>> elements. However, this is easy to fix:
>>
>> tf1[expr_] :=
>> expr /. z_NonCommutativeMultiply :>
>> If[Not[OrderedQ[z]], Signature[List @@ z]*Sort[z], z]
>>
>> I think will not work correctly:
>>
>> Simplify[x ** y + y ** x, TransformationFunctions -> {Automatic,
>> tf1}]
>> 0
>>
>> Simplify[(z ** x ** y + z ** y ** x),
>> TransformationFunctions -> {Automatic, tf1}]
>> 0
>>
>> As for your question; yes. Simplification generally only proceeds to
>> forms which are simpler (with respect to the given complexity
>> function, which can be user controlled) at every step. However, there
>> are some exceptions to this, because at eeach step simplify remembers
>> not only the form of the expression that has the least complexity
>> found so far but also (for most expression) a standard form of the
>> expression. It will therefore sometimes notice cancellations when
>> between two expressions which have the same standard form, even if
>> there is no complexity decreasing route "connecting" them. But this
>> is =
>
>> not really something that a user can control and shows itself most
>> often when Simplify is used to show that some expression is 0 (rather
>> then in finding the simplest form of the expression).
>>
>> Andrzej Kozlowski
>
> sorry, maybe my question is to general. more precisely:
>
> i have
> In[1]:= tr[l___ ** (a_ + b_) ** r___] := l ** a ** r + l ** b ** r
>
> This DON'T work:
> In[2]:= Simplify[a ** (b + c) ** d - a ** b ** d,
> TransformationFunctions -> {Automatic, tr}]
> Out[2]:= -(a ** b ** d) + a ** (b + c) ** d
>
> But this DOES work of course
> In[3]:= Simplify[tr[a ** (b + c) ** d] - a ** b ** d,
> TransformationFunctions -> {Automatic}]
> Out[3]:= a ** c ** d
>
> Question is: exist way to describe function "tr" to act only on part
> of expression
> or
> is way to tell Simplify to try apply transformation function "tr" to
> EACH part of expression
>
> thanks a lot
>
Yes, you can do the latter.
tr[expr_] := expr /. l___ ** (a_ + b_) ** r___ :> l ** a ** r + l ** b
** r
Simplify[a ** (b + c) ** d - a ** b ** d, TransformationFunctions ->
{Automatic, tr}]
a ** c ** d
Andrzej Kozlowski
- References:
- Re: TransformationFunctions
- From: Peter Breitfeld <phbrf@t-online.de>
- Re: TransformationFunctions
- From: O <kakabomba@gmail.com>
- Re: TransformationFunctions