Re: New Wolfram Tutorial Collection documentation is ready

*To*: mathgroup at smc.vnet.net*Subject*: [mg99692] Re: New Wolfram Tutorial Collection documentation is ready*From*: Bob F <deepyogurt at gmail.com>*Date*: Mon, 11 May 2009 06:25:21 -0400 (EDT)*References*: <gu3arb$t79$1@smc.vnet.net>

On May 9, 1:20 am, John Fultz <jfu... at wolfram.com> wrote: > A followup to an earlier post of mine (snipping the irrelevant bits out). .. > > > > On Sat, 2 May 2009 11:36:22 -0500, John Fultz wrote: > > On Sat, 2 May 2009 05:55:57 -0400 (EDT), Bob F wrote: > > >> I looked at one of the files (Visualization & Graphics) also, and > >> tried to do some copy/paste from both Acrobat and Preview on a Mac, > >> into Mathematica and it doesn't work very well. A simple line that > >> says in the PDF file: > > >> Plot[Cos[x], {x,-Pi,Pi}] > > >> comes out like this when pasted into some other program like this > >> Safari browser window) > > >> Plot@Cos@xD, 8x, -Pi, Pi<D > > >> and when copied from Mathematica Virtual Book comes out fine and is > >> pasted as: > > >> Plot[Cos[x], {x, -Pi, Pi}] > > >> so these files don't seem to be real useful if you want to extract > >> code examples. This seems rather weird as these are all normal ASCII > >> characters. So the Documentation Center & Virtual Book windows in > >> Mathematica are looking a like the way to go if you wish to do any > >> copying and pasting of code examples. > > : > :>> -Bob > > > Thanks for the various remarks. > > : > :> Concerning copy/paste, this is due to the fact that the PDF focuses on > > being a high-fidelity visual representation of the in-product > > documentation. Since inputs can contain typesetting, non-ASCII > > characters, etc., no attempt was made to convert them to an InputForm > > equivalent. So these are StandardForm cells which, among other things, > > use Mathematica fonts to represent characters such as square brackets. > > I.e., the content of the PDF is exactly as Mathematica would display it > > on-screen or print it to the printer. And, as you say, we do have the > > in-product Virtual Book if you're looking for interactivity with > > Mathematica. > > : > : > > > John Fultz > > jfu... at wolfram.com > > User Interface Group > > Wolfram Research, Inc. > > In the interest of making sure the information out there is correct, let me > follow up on this and point out that, under Windows, if you copy from Adobe > Acrobat Reader and paste directly in Mathematica, it *does* work just fine. > > I'm guessing that the reports of this not working are coming from Macintosh > users (correct me if I'm wrong), and I wouldn't expect this to work under Linux, > either. The reason this works under Windows is pretty technical, but it > basically has to do with how Reader and Mathematica interact with each other on > the clipboard (*). Note that a similar issue would be observed under Windows, > too, if you copied from the PDFs and pasted to Notepad. > > The reason for the system dependency is because we're relying on features of the > system clipboard, which vary from one operating system to another. And none of > this here negates the suggestion that we should look into making copy/paste work > better on Mac, which I'm discussing with the documentation production group. > > Sincerely, > > John Fultz > jfu... at wolfram.com > User Interface Group > Wolfram Research, Inc. > > (*) A slightly self-serving footnote. A little embarrassingly, I implemented > the feature which made this work, and yet it never occurred to me that it would > kick in with pleasant consequences here until I tried it. The lesson is that > software systems (of all kinds, but certainly including Mathematica) are really > complex, and sometimes in ways that even surprise their creators. I'm a bit confused -- first you say that it can't work because of the complexities with making sure that things "look" right (see post #18 in this thread). Now you say (in post #20 in this thread) it works on Windows but not Mac's. Are you talking about the same thing? What generated the PDF file you are doing the copying (was it a Mathematica generated PDF or ???)? So are you saying that this copy/paste will generally work when doing it on a Windows system, no matter the complexity of the input expression, or ??? And likewise that it will never work on a Mac? If it depends on the complexity of the expression, can you make any statements like "if you avoid using the symbol "xxx" (fill xxx in with the symbols that apply -- perhaps xxx is an empty set) this copy/paste will generally work with PDF files generated by Mathematica on Windows when pasting back into Mathematica" or that Mac's "copy/paste will almost never work on a Mac OS X system from a PDF file generated with Mathematica back into Mathematica". What if I took the PDF file that was created on a Mac version of Mathematica and put it on a Windows system, would Mathematica on Windows handle it correctly? This is getting murkier and murkier ;-) Is this considered a bug and is being worked on for the Mac OS X version of Mathematica? Thanks.... -Bob

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