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Re: Re: Re: Orientation of characters in FrameLabel

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  • Subject: [mg22087] Re: [mg22076] Re: [mg22040] Re: Orientation of characters in FrameLabel
  • From: Andrzej Kozlowski <andrzej at>
  • Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 01:14:05 -0500 (EST)
  • Sender: owner-wri-mathgroup at

A couple of corrections to my last message. One is that I gave the wrong
Red-Hat list address for those who really would like to check for themselves
how Linux users spend their time trying to solve problems which other system
users take for granted: try  redhat-list at

Also the beginning of my message somehow got lost, it said:

Concerning your last remark: all Mac DTP oriented programs support text
rotation. I do this myself with Free Hand quite often. So much for that.

Andrzej Kozlowski
Toyama International University
Toyama, Japan

> on 00.2.13 3:06 AM, Bojan Bistrovic at bojanb at wrote:
>>> on 00.2.11 4:38 PM, Jens-Peer Kuska at kuska at
>>> wrote:
>>>> You may switch to a modern computer with a less primitive operating
>>>> system
>>>> (i. e. not a Mac)
>>> This just shows ignorance or prejudice, particularly in view that most
>>> professional DTP work is still done on Macs. There is a lot more to an
>>> operating system than the ability to rotate text. Besides, what is primitive
>>> depends on ones perspective. I use the Mac all the time and Linux fairly
>>> often and "primitive" is just the word that  comes to my mind whenever I do
>>> the latter.
>>> Andrzej Kozlowski
>>> Toyama International University
>>> Toyama, Japan
>> With all due respect to Mac users, I have to agree with Jens-Peer here.
>> You might not like your favorite pet (i.e. MacOS) being called primitive, but
>> try leaving a VERY long computation (over a month for example) on a Mac; the
>> odds are it will crash the very first day, if not the very first hour.
>> Windows will probably crash on the second or the third day. Any Unix
>> (including Linux) will not only do it, but will do it's daily amount of work
>> as well. I DO know professionals in DTP; they use Mac's for digital image
>> processing. What do they do after EVERY PICTURE? They reboot their Mac's
>> because if they don't, the odds are it will crash in the middle of next
>> picture. This is a real-life example. People don't like Unix/Linux because
>> "you have to use the keyboard to get anything done" (this is again a real
>> citation). Well, first of all, that's not really true, and second, not
>> everybody is allergic to keyboards. Some people like them. "Primitiveness" of
>> an operating system isn't related to the fact how often do you have to use
>> the
>> keyboard, but to the stability, reliability, speed, etc. Apple/Microsoft duet
>> has managed to convince the world that a computer is a tool EVERY idiot
>> should
>> be able to use. While I agree that reading your email or browsing the web
>> shouldn't require a PhD in computer science, I just don't see how can ANY
>> user of very technical product like Mathematica be delighted by the power of
>> Mathematica and at the same time dislike an operating system because some
>> thing can't be done with a click of a mouse. Let me make an analogy: would
>> you prefer to drive a nice looking car that broke down EVERY SINGLE DAY or
>> a less pretty one that drives forever without breaking down? If you're a Mac
>> user, I bet you never changed the oil or a flat tire on your car yourself,
>> did
>> you? Not changing the oil or ever doing any work on your car yourself doesn't
>> make you a bad person; it just makes you unqualified to discuss properties of
>> an engine or the transmission. Well, the same hold for OS; if you buy a
>> particular computer because it comes in nice colors, it doesn't' mean you're
>> a
>> bad person; it just makes you unqualified to judge the "primitiveness" of
>> other operating systems.
>> Bye, Bojan
>> PS:if you're into DTP, I'd say that rotating text is pretty IMPORTANT for
>> you,
>> don't you agree?
>> --
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Bojan Bistrovic,                               bojanb at
>> Old Dominion University, Norfolk VA & Jefferson Lab, Newport News, VA
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> As for the rest of your diatribe: all I can say is that if you can spend your
> time on learning ridiculous Unix commands or trying to work out why your "
> advanced" Linux system cannot recognise your newly installed, (supposedly
> compatible network card), than I can't see how you can ever do any serious
> work in mathematics, or physics etc (though you may perhaps call yourself a
> "IT" expert, whatever that is)..  Anybody who does not believe this should
> join for a short time the Red Hat mailing list (
> redhat-announce-list at; you will then proceed to receive about a
> hundred messages a day and see for yourself what sort of absurd problems
> people waste their time on, just to give themselves the illusion of
> superiority. I for one prefer to spend my time proving theorems (or at least
> trying to). That's, by the way, why I use Mathematica and not, for example, C.
> On a personal note: I have have used the Mac and a variety of unix systems
> (the latter unwillingly)  for about 15 years so I know quite a bit about both.
> --
> Andrzej Kozlowski
> Toyama International University
> Toyama, Japan

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