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Re: Log[x]//TraditionalForm

  • To: mathgroup at smc.vnet.net
  • Subject: [mg96222] Re: Log[x]//TraditionalForm
  • From: "David Park" <djmpark at comcast.net>
  • Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 05:38:14 -0500 (EST)
  • References: <200902031132.GAA00303@smc.vnet.net> <7461949.1234000227010.JavaMail.root@m02>

When I was studying electrical engineering, we had a well known professor,
Ernst A. Guillemin. He always used 'p' to stand for complex frequency as did
many other authors. But then some professional electrical engineering
society decreed that 'p' must always be used for complex frequency. This
attempted coercion made him angry and from then on he always used 's',
taking much of the profession with him.

Mathematical symbols are always arbitrary and the only important thing is
that a book or application make explicit the meaning of the symbols used.
And Mathematica does make clear how Log is used. Presumably, the reader or
user will know what he wants.


David Park
djmpark at comcast.net
http://home.comcast.net/~djmpark/  


 

From: peter [mailto:plindsay.0 at gmail.com] 


not being a very advanced person myself, and only being an engineer, I
have to admit to thinking that ln was the correct name for natural
log. Thank god I've been put right on this.

regards

Peter

2009/2/6 Murray Eisenberg <murray at math.umass.edu>:
> So far as I have seen, almost any recently published, high-selling
> textbook in calculus -- as distinct from advanced calculus or analysis
> -- aimed at the U.S. market uses ln rather than log for the natural
> logarithm.
>
> No wonder students are confused when they go on to a more advanced
> course and suddenly it's log, not ln.
>
> Then of course there's the issue that computer scientists often use log
> to mean base-2 log.
>
> Andrzej Kozlowski wrote:
>> Tthe notation ln seems to have become essentially extinct since the
>> disappearance of slide rules. It fact, was almost never used in books
>> on analysis or calculus aimed at mathematicians. I have just checked and
>> Dieudonne, Foundations of Modern Analysis, published in 1969 uses log,
>> Apostol, Calculus, published in 1967 uses log, Rudin, "Principles of
>> Modern Analysis", published in 1964 uses L after remarking that "the
>> usual notation is, of corse, log"), Rudin "Real and complex analysis",
>> published in 1970 uses (naturally) log. Of 5 books that I have looked
>> at only one, Fichtenholtz - A course of differential and integral
>> calculus (in Russian) published in 1966 uses ln, which is presumably
>> because it was aimed at engineers, who in those days still used slide
>> rules (at least in Russia). (In spite of that, it is still a rather
>> good book).
>>
>> Andrzej Kozlowski
>>
>>
>> On 4 Feb 2009, at 11:18, Murray Eisenberg wrote:
>>
>>> No, in mathematics log x or log(x) is a perfectly acceptable, perhaps
>>> the predominant, notation for the base-e, natural logarithm.
>>>
>>> In calculus books, ln x or ln(x) is typically used for that --  so as
>>> not to confuse students who were taught that log means the base-10
>>> logarithm.
>>>
>>> O.T.: P.S. M.I.T. has an all-male a cappella singing group named the
>>> "Logarhythms".
>>>
>>> slawek wrote:
>>>> The natural logarithm function in "traditional form" in Mathematica
>>>> (version
>>>> 6.0.2.0)
>>>>
>>>>  Log[x]//TraditionalForm
>>>>  log(x)
>>>>
>>>> This is "not a bug but a feature", but in mathematics the natural
>>>> logarithm
>>>> is just ln(x) or even ln x.
>>>> The true traditional notation use log for decimal logarithm, ln for
>>>> natural
>>>> logarithm, lb for binary logarithm, and
>>>> log_{b}x  for logarithm with base b. Unfortunatelly in most computer
>>>> programs (see FORTRAN) LOG
>>>> stands for natural logarithm (an exception is Pascal).
>>>>
>>>> Nevertheless, how to force to use ln(x) instead log(x) ?
>>>>
>>>> The brute way is use /.Log->ln//TraditionalForm.
>>>>
>>>> Is any more elegant way to do this?
>>>>
>>>> slawek
>>>>
>>>>
>>> --
>>> Murray Eisenberg                     murray at math.umass.edu
>>> Mathematics & Statistics Dept.
>>> Lederle Graduate Research Tower      phone 413 549-1020 (H)
>>> University of Massachusetts                413 545-2859 (W)
>>> 710 North Pleasant Street            fax   413 545-1801
>>> Amherst, MA 01003-9305
>>>
>>
>>
>
> --
> Murray Eisenberg                     murray at math.umass.edu
> Mathematics & Statistics Dept.
> Lederle Graduate Research Tower      phone 413 549-1020 (H)
> University of Massachusetts                413 545-2859 (W)
> 710 North Pleasant Street            fax   413 545-1801
> Amherst, MA 01003-9305
>
>




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